Mighty Snakefist post his bug reports wherever He pleases to, since he's NeoCore tester since VH1 times. But what he does is Wise and Purposeful, because some things should be more public, some less and some completely private. Most reports are on Mantis...

On Steam Early Access - guess nothing can be changed now, what's done is done. NeoCore had this situation before, so it's not like they don't know what might happen. Snakefist would, personally, release the most bug-free version ever, which 5.0.1 is not.

When deciding how to buy something, Average Review might influence Snakefist in case he's just browsing or checking out game which he has no knowledge about. If He is interested in buying, He (in His Wisdom), instantly dismisses:

- all reviews with <10h (for games which are not replayable) or <100h often more for highly-replayable stuff (4X, aRPGs and alike)

- negative reviews, without explanations

- negative reviews with high number of hours played, AFTER he reads them and conclude that same things which bothered reviewer won't bother Him (there could be a good reason for player to leave game after 5,000h - or perhaps not; these players update their reviews, though)

In high hour count positive reviews, he would still look for flaws, because some of them could bother Him much more than reviewer.

MOST OF THE PLAYERS DO EXACTLY THE OPPOSITE. There are 'random buyers' who expect something else and are angry, in essence, because they didn't read what the game is about at all. Browse-I-don't-like-it-in-0.2h, because of Steam return policy, but still having an irresistible need to review the game. The mentioned 1080Ti-won't-run-it-4k-on-144Hz. All kinds, couple together with one need - Snakefist once checked a guys profile with ~1700 reviews, He swears there wasn't 1,000h in all of them together. A review-troll.

We may have a positive reviews from this community, but in one week we'll be outnumbered many times, and who can tell what those players would base their opinion on?

But risk is taken already... It wasn't announced even as a possibility, so that's a decision set deeply in the past. 

I think these days more of the "my two thousand dollar system is getting bad frames" comes from people that don't understand that price tag is not a set route to performance, rather than just not understanding the alpha. Like people who buy the top-end cards as soon as they're released, and always end up getting a pair that consists of that one chip in the series that is more expensive but bottlenecks terribly when running as a multi-GPU setup in most games. "I HAVE TWO GPUS WITH 16 GIGS OF RAM TOTAL 40 FPS WTF WORST GAME EVER!"

Not that I've seen that thread hundreds of times, nope. /sarcasm

I know a couple personally in meatspace that can't understand how someone might not turn every setting possible to the highest notch; it usually translates as "this game runs so horribly" while on my budget box, the same title might be humming along at 60-150 stable frames per second just because I cranked down a few things--things that most people don't even notice unless they're running gigantic monitors in the first place.

I'm not... arguing against Neocore releasing it to Early Access, I'm just underlining issues we're going to see and have to deal with.. While the Neocore forums will largely be safe from some of the worst, the in-game chat is going to decline sharply and... well... releasing it right before a character wipe update just seems to be a case of really, really bad timing.

Agree again, and I quite enjoyed Deathwing, was very immersive and not too easy (probably bias seeing I play ....or at least played DA most on tabletop). But yes it received an unjustified overly bad wrap imo.

I can see the reviews being bad due to lack of understanding what really entail early access ( i.e. my 2k+ system only sees 40fps wtf)  but as Airsick has said the game will benefit for those of us truly dedicated to its testing and eventual release with additional playtesters coming on board. 

No matter how its marketed though there will be many who simply cannot or will not understand its not yet a finished game. Sadly those who rely solely on the overall review stats will missout on something that seems to be shaping up as a decent 40k title.

Not comparing the two genres at all, I'm pointing out that since a very popular Valve product is getting reviewbombed, it might get them to finally address the terribly easy to abuse review system, but then tempering that with a dose of "but it's doubtful" because, well.. it's Valve. Steam hovers between "worthless" and "vaguely useful" depending on client update, and they seem disinclined to shake things up. Comparing a MOBA, which is Skinner box trash, with an ARPG, which is an artful Skinner box, would be silly.

@Hydra: I understand the idea, but I've seen a handful of good betas--with regular updates and a team that listens to the community--still end up with terrible, toxic cesspools pretending to be communities coupled with yards of "reviews" largely relating to things like not having a feature that doesn't even fit the genre or random ASCII spam. Or, my personal "favorite", complaints about "no hardcore mode".

Because that's an appropriate reason to make a game out to be the worst bit of digital trash ever. /sarcasm

Thought I had heard/played many games. Never heard of either, that's more the issue. Compairing a MOBA to a ARPG does not explain any thing to me. The minute I see the word MOBA i turn off.

Giving things more time sounds nice but the bulk of feedback consists of between 10-20 people writing posts in varying levels of detail, with feature requests mixed in. The community is great. Some of the posts are very insightful. But right now there isn't a healthy number of people who want to provide feedback. Of those that we do have, they don't really represent the average steam gamer. 

TLDR - Why not make Betas great again - Show players what regular content, developer communication and organic development can look like. Set the standard again and ignore those who are lost to the warp of 2017. Raises fists. Hail Hydra Io/

Space Hulk: Deathwing barely survived the reviewbombing, and even now the multiplayer community is pitifully small compared to their earlier title, EYE: Divine Cybermancy (itself a brilliant but janky love-letter to both 40k and cyberpunk). I have very little doubt EYE would not have garnered the cult gathering it did if it had been released during the era of terribly controlled Steam reviews--the surveys and polls on the matter flatly state that more than half of Steam users will just decide to not purchase a game if the reviews are any worse than Mixed. For that matter, Deathwing wasn't nearly as terrible as it's made out to be in the Mostly Negative average score that it had, last I checked. Nor is it appreciated that any of the Founders will get a little icon when posting a review that shows we got it from a non-steam source, indelibly marking us as "white knights" in the parliance of Steam forums.

As to allowing reviews, that wouldn't be a bad limitation--but something in place to watch for copypasta ("0/10 would not potato") or meme ASCII images would also be appreciated. And not forthcoming, because Valve doesn't view it as a priority; though they might now that their MOBA is getting reviewbombed over there not being a new Half Life title. We shall see.

It doesn't help that Steam itself can be a toxic cesspool (hah, can be); I'm not looking forward to what we're bound to see in-game in coming months.

It just seems entirely too early to me, after taking part in a number of Early Access titles, and being part of proper beta testing cycles well prior to that; people are... no longer as hip to what "beta" means now; and I will continue to blame the proliferation of free-to-play MMOs that would go through year long "beta periods" where the game was essentially feature complete, but offering "discounted founder" cash shop deals in order to recoup development costs for that.

Is that like telling @snakefistisfo where to post bug reports :S

That's a lot of effort and thinking for me. I find it easier to just stay off the steam discussion page. If i want a review now days the only ones i pay any cred's to is youtube review's (not play through's)

I hear you and agree, but end of the day any gamer with more than half a brain can see past the Shit posting steam reviews, hell I have bought and enjoyed quite a few with generally bad reviews on steam, some games just don't live up to the hype but it doesn't necessarily mean they are bad just not what was expected.

I believe personally that Steam should not allow reviews by players with under 20 hours playtime (at minimum).

THERE WILL BE A TOUGH STEAM-COMMENT-HERESY TO DEAL WITH !!!

Well, on a positive note, wargamer.com has a good post-Gamescom mention of Martyr on their site this morning.

Yeah thats right. But this is where our Job starts.

But we can guide new players through their first Matches or posting Basic Guides  to ease their entry.

Yeah, if that were how it worked that'd be great.

But Steam marks those of us who bought/redeemed outside of steam with a little icon, and the shitposters/trolls take that as "rabid fanboys/white knights". The sad part is, that the majority of steam users no longer even bother to read the reviews, they just look at the "Positive/Mixed/Negative" marker and go from there. Unless Neocore gets very lucky, we're going to see a lot of terrible reviews from people that don't understand, ignored the Alpha Client tag, ignored everything, play for ten minutes, and post either a meme or a "could not play 0/10".

To make matters worse, Valve still hasn't incorporated anything to fight the meme shitpost "reviews" that contribute nothing but are still there to rot in games. An ASCII image is not a review, prune it. "10/10 would potato again" is not a review, prune it. "Skeleton frank is taking over reviews" IS NOT A REVIEW, $@#$ PRUNE IT. Ugh.

Personally after seeing a load of bad (and a number of good) games bomb on Steam after reviewbombing, memes, and shitposting in the reviews, I see this as a bad move. Way too early. I would personally pose that Neocore should wait until after some solid feedback for the next milestone comes back, so that they know whether or not much of the turn-off content has been fixed, before running into the wretched hive of corruption and heresy that is steam.

I can see it now, beyond the terrible "I don't know how to computer" reviews, "grindy content", "trash mobs heal too fast wtf", "trash mobs deal too much damage wtf", "this game is too hard" (when players start with missions rather than investigations), there's a large list I've already put together in my head. We should start a Derp Pool. Like a Death Pool, but with odds on stupid shitpost reviews, so we can at least get some enjoyment out of morons flipping out about the game. :D

Those are (reported) bugs existing in 0.5.1, reported by Mighty Snakefist:

- no +30HP regeneration for Toughness 10 attribute

- graphical glitches (two kinds) on Rebel factions maps

- no Bag awards for Cathedral endless missions in multiplayer (there are in single player)

- merchant/crafting bugs show various levels (might be solved server-side, it was wildly fluctuating yesterday)

Also, about 100+ more on Mantis, with unknown status. 

Yesteday, Mighty Snakefist had 3 crashes to desktop (on a very stable computer).

It doesn't seem as a relatively stable build suitable for first impressions on Steam. Later versions could have it, but people will be suspicious on anything with 'mixed' or lower opinion, therefore generating less income and hurting the reputation.

You are a relevant authority on that matter? Snakefist was under, obviously wrong, impression that developers are giving such informations...

Wipe is coming with next milestone as it includes tutorials and new level character content, including a complete re-balance of progression and the power level system. Can't remember the specific staff member who told me. But i'm 95% sure that's what I heard.

@snakefist

You will not get informed when a wipe will happen. 

snakefist did say a lot but nothing useful or important

And to another note, what will this means to existing accounts and characters? Full wipe?

If so, Snakefist would like to know this in advance, because there's something else he'd liked to do with his His character before the wipe...

Will I be able to upgrade my pack from my steam wallet when you release it to EA?

Can't help but thinking the same thing.

This game realy has potential to be a great game, but isnt it a bit soon to open the floodgates?

Let the games begin....

Boy, I don't know about this. I think waiting until after the next major update & character wipe might have been a smarter way to go. The amount of content is still kinda thin at this point. The Steam masses will not bother to read the roadmap or like the fact that their progress will be wiped after just a month in.

Well, it is what it is. GL, fingers crossed. The Emperor Protects !

Just wait for the "Can't run this on my i7" - When they have a Core i7-920. Facepalm

Peeps need to realise that CPU's aren't apple products. The number immediately after the "i" doesn't mean how awesome it is.

Take into consideration the next milestone arrives soon. Neocore is committed to this and needs to stick to because right now their consistency as a developer is one of their best assets and strengths within reviews. Delaying E/A means introducing new players to the first week of the largest milestone to date. Which will include .... Bugs! Not the nice type either. The type that make players really annoyed because they can't even play.

What we have right now, is probably the most stable opportunity we will see for the foreseeable future, unless of course you want to delay E/A 48 hours after announcing it and also delay the next milestone too. Trashing most of the goodwill they have accumulated. Now I totally appreciate your message and agree with the sentiment, it's clear you want whats best for the game. Giving a nice first impression would be "ideal". But when things are done in life that aren't ideal, its often for good reason. Lack of alternative. 

That being said I "hope" they manage to remove some of the more nastier crashes / freezes before those players arrive. But have confidence that they will. 

Snakefist will take this as a kind of joke, though it isn't particularly funny to him - tastes do differ, some might like it.

Mighty Snakefist was (and is) external beta-tester for NeoCore for several years. Any non-trivial change can have bugs. Internal testing is done on limited number of machines which cannot possibly represent anything close to releasing the game 'in the wild' - there are weird configuration, people with limited net-access (and knowledge) who are behind firewalls, old drivers or computers with few uncommon parts, not to go any further...

It is, of course, impossible to predict what will happen on release - but at least when known bugs are fixed, there should be another test phase on larger scale, such as this. Bugs which WE report are mainly ones that passed internal check already. That's the order of things and it simply can't be challenged.

As for giving credits, well, Snakefist was with NeoCore since VH1, his intentions are always good though sometimes not pleasant to hear. Which is known to devs.

LOL. Awsome. Why can't I play offline on my potato? Can't I run on my windows xp in 640 res.

Yes the 5 minute gametime 'experienced' Steam reviews shall be entertaining....

Agree a pop up or ingame notification pre purchace and even ingame upon login would benefit, something along the lines of "REMINDER, Inquisitor Martyr is still in early play testing character/account level wipes may occur at any time without warning".

Understand where Snakefist is coming from, but I I would hope any smart gamers interested in the game do not or will not rely on poorly based reviews or that of people with low gaming hours, I have well over 500 hours invested so far and I will review it from my experiences to date (which are positive) hopefully this gives potential gamers a decent review (when I get around to writing it this weekend)

Will this Early Access build come out with the Psyker available for testing or soon after?  Also is there planned loot beyond the Relic level like Ancient gear or "legendary" gear that is named after someone important?  

Graphical bugs doesnt really bother me, and a mission today provided some hilarious flavor to the mix.  Imagine the puny Sniper Assassin kicking the dead carcass of a Leman Russ into a lake.  Wish I recorded that.  :)  

I do see a steady influx of new testers trying the game out so the buzz around the project should be really positive.  Maybe put up a News Bulletin ingame to inform folks of upcoming patches, hotfixes, content, character resets, etc.

This is a good game but we need Chinese   by:：google translation

Tender has posted below that the release will be timed with an update.

One can presume it'll take the form of an internally tested Hot-fix. Think we need to give them a little more credit, the majority of bugs we are currently reported have already been fixed developer side and presumably waiting to be implemented in said update.

Hmmm... Each patch had new bugs, while fixing (some) of the old ones. This is a very close date, shouldn't there be a bugfix FIRST, then some more testing, THEN releasing that bug-fixed version?

Mighty Snakefist, in His Endless Experience, is rather sure that having "Early Access" mark won't stop people from making bad reviews (most of them never revisiting them again), because important reason such as:

"'I was playing with a friend, and there was a bug. I sincerely cannot recommend this game to anyone", 0.2h played, thumb down.

0.5.1 is very buggy, and even a fixed version should be tested more, before letting it in the wild...

If a wipe is planned for early September, tbh I feel holding off an Early Access release until thats done would be wise. People who bought into the Alpha here know what the score is, but the Steam hordes might not be forgiving if their characters are wiped after a few days / a week's worth of playing unless its made very clear on the page (and perhaps a splash screen ingame) that several more character wipes are to be expected before full release. 

A friend of mine was just complaining yesterday that it wasn't on Steam. 

He has alot of steamwallet $ and didn't want to directly charge it on a card. 

Good timing.

Steam Achievements?!

Will this release coincide with the September Roadmap's character wipe?  I would certainly hope so.

It deeply upsets me that I can't upload my "Brace yourself - Steam comments are coming" meme.

Bring it on though, getting some quantitative feedback will be really interesting to see how the game is received. Bring on the surveys!

Will the version available from August 31st on Steam be different from the present?